What Is Sleep Training, Really? With That Sleep Doc (Part 1)

We made it to 100 episodes and we couldn't think of a better way to celebrate. Sally's heart was beating the whole time 'cause she's that much of a fangirl.

Our guest is the one and only Dr Sujay Kansagra, known to so many of you as That Sleep Doc. He's a child neurologist and sleep medicine doctor at Duke University, where he directs the child neurology sleep medicine program. Sally DM'd him on the seventh of December 2024, before Nap Trapped even existed. It was left on unread. A hundred episodes later, here we are.

In part one we rip the band aid and ask what sleep training actually is, whether sleep associations are real and how you tell a sleep association from a baby seeking connection. Sujay walks us through the learned helplessness research, attachment, night feeds and breastfeeding, parent guilt and why a well rested parent is a safer driver. He also tells us why he invented what he calls the most expensive crib mattress in the world and still says sleep training is safe and effective.

Then we get into the hard bit: the crying. How Sujay coaches families through it, the two methods he reaches for and why even he found sleep training his own kids hard. Sally shares the early rising that finally shifted once she sent her husband to the gym. Bec's famous line gets a run too. Hold steady.

If you've been fear mongered out of getting help, this one's for you.

Subscribe to Nap Trapped wherever you listen and find every episode at www.naptrappedpodcast.com

What You'll Learn:

- Why there's no formal definition of sleep training and how Sujay defines it

- How sleep cycles and normal night wakings bring sleep associations into play

- How to tell if a sleep association is actually a problem for your household

- What the 1960s learned helplessness experiments do and don't tell us about sleep trained babies

- What the research says about sleep training and attachment

- Why night feeds and breastfeeding can sit alongside sleep training

- The two types of crying and how Sujay matches a method to a family's tolerance

- Why having someone in your corner through the execution makes such a difference

Chapters:

00:00 Happy 100th, Dr. Sujay

05:01 So, What Is Sleep Training?

19:31 Busting the Sleep Training Myths

37:26 Coaching Families Through Crying

45:45 Part Two Next Week

ABOUT:

We're Sally Woods from The Sleep Concierge and Bec Maher from The Sleep Centre. Nap Trapped is our evidence-based baby sleep podcast for tired parents who want real answers without the fear mongering. Dr Sujay Kansagra is a child neurologist and sleep medicine doctor at Duke University and the creator of Lullabee. You'll find him on social media as That Sleep Doc.

Links:

Sally, The Sleep Concierge: https://www.instagram.com/thesleepconcierge/

Bec, The Sleep Centre: https://www.instagram.com/_thesleepcentre/

Dr Sujay Kansagra, That Sleep Doc: https://www.instagram.com/thatsleepdoc/

That Sleep Doc on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thatsleepdoc

That Sleep Doc on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thatsleepdoc

All of That Sleep Doc's links: https://linktr.ee/thatsleepdoc

Camp Snooze intakes: joinsnooze.com

Nap Trapped: www.naptrappedpodcast.com