How Microaggressions can have significant negative impacts (with Dr. Kecia Thomas )
Show notes
While the podcast team is taking a Radical Sabbatical, Kim is interviewing authors of the books that have had a big impact on her in the past two years.
In this episode, Kim Scott speaks with Dr. Kecia Thomas, an organizational psychologist renowned for her research on workplace dynamics. Kim discusses Dr. Thomas’ research on the 'Pet to Threat' framework, which explores the experiences of women, particularly women of color, in organizational settings. They discuss the transition from being seen as a 'pet' to a 'threat' in the workplace, the impact of gender and leadership dynamics, and the resistance to diversity within organizations. Dr. Thomas emphasizes the importance of recognizing covert forms of discrimination and the need for organizations to embrace discomfort to foster inclusivity. They also explore the complexities of race, advertising, microaggressions, and the challenges faced by marginalized groups in leadership roles. They discuss the impact of colorblind messaging in organizations, the emotional labor involved in diversity work, and the intersectionality of class and race in higher education. The dialogue emphasizes the importance of understanding and addressing these issues to create more inclusive environments.
Both Kim and Dr. Thomas agree that embracing discomfort is crucial for organizations to evolve. They discuss how rejecting these feelings only exacerbates issues within workplace cultures. Instead, recognizing and addressing this discomfort can create pathways for growth and improvement.
Guest Background: Dr. Kecia Thomas is an industrial-organizational psychologist, diversity scientist, keynote speaker, board advisor, and leadership coach. She helps leaders align culture, trust, belonging, and performance to build healthier, higher-performing organizations. Dr. Thomas is the lead psychologist behind Pet to Threat™, a groundbreaking framework examining how high-potential marginalized employees can experience celebration and exploitation, followed by promotion and alienation, at work. Her expertise has been sought by major corporations, national institutions, universities, school districts, and healthcare organizations.
CHAPTERS
(00:21) Introduction to Pet to Threat Framework
(03:16) Experiences of Women in Leadership
(06:10) Understanding the Pet to Threat Transition
(09:01) The Impact of Gender and Leadership
(11:45) Diversity Resistance in Organizations
(14:39) The Role of Organizational Culture
(17:12) The Importance of Naming Experiences
(19:26) The Covert Forms of Resistance
(22:27) The Consequences of Exclusion
(24:56) Good Intentions Gone Awry
(27:22) The Impact of Advertising on Racial Perceptions
(29:31) Microaggressions and Their Consequences
(32:54) Colorblindness in Organizational Messaging
(36:57) Navigating Unintended Offenses in Communication
(39:33) The Emotional Labor of Diversity Work
(40:51) Leadership Challenges for Marginalized Groups
(48:43) Class Bias in Higher Education
(52:13) Intersectionality and Social Distance
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Keywords
Pet to Threat, organizational psychology, diversity, inclusion, women in leadership, gender bias, workplace culture, resistance, covert discrimination, leadership dynamics advertising, racial perceptions, microaggressions, colorblindness, diversity, emotional labor, leadership, class bias, intersectionality
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